TheBusiness
New Member
I was listening to gospel music via youtube and came across numerous videos of ppl miming with make up to the music. Is there a reason why they do this ? Is this a form of praise dancing ?
Why do they mime in Gospel?
- Thread starter TheBusiness
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aribell
formerly nicola.kirwan
Do you mean like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEA3TtRVPrc
That was a clip of a group at my former university. It's another form of praise. In person it can be very very powerful.
That was a clip of a group at my former university. It's another form of praise. In person it can be very very powerful.
Forever in Bloom
Well-Known Member
It frightens me - only because I have a fear of mimes/clowns. So imagine a whole bunch of 'em running up on stage, and me trembling in fear. T'aint funny 
That's why I'm looking for another church to attend. I should have been prepped before they did that 
The even scarier part is that the guy who is over it is constantly sending me Facebook messages to add their mime group to my Facebook page. EEEK!!
That's why I'm looking for another church to attend. I should have been prepped before they did that The even scarier part is that the guy who is over it is constantly sending me Facebook messages to add their mime group to my Facebook page. EEEK!!
TheBusiness
New Member
The clips I've seen on youtube did look pretty powerful . Ive seen the one where two brothers was miming to "Praise is what I do" and I thought it was nice but the white makeup/mime makeup looked a bit creepy to me but i figure there must be a reason why that's done. Im going to go look at that youtube clip nicola just posted right now.
It frightens me - only because I have a fear of mimes/clowns. So imagine a whole bunch of 'em running up on stage, and me trembling in fear. T'aint funny
The even scarier part is that the guy who is over it is constantly sending me Facebook messages to add their mime group to my Facebook page. EEEK!!
honey, God didnt give you that spirit of fear, so you need to pray to get delivered NOT switch churches solely because of fright. Because trust and believe that miming will follow you to any church you go to just because you're running from it
Vonnieluvs08
Well-Known Member
It is a form of praise and worship. There are people in my church who mime and I've been to some events where there have been those who mime. It can be a very powerful experience from what I've witnessed. It also is an outlet for those who can not dance or dance well or sing to praise and worship the Father through song and actions.
It seems to becoming very popular amongst college aged Christians, in my observations.
It seems to becoming very popular amongst college aged Christians, in my observations.
momi
Well-Known Member
Forever in Bloom
Well-Known Member
That's not the only reason I am looking for another church to attend - I have been a member of this particular church for 9 years, and the sermons tend to revolve around the same topic - finances. There is one church I would like to visit though. Not everyone is going to just love mimes. I happen to not like them. That is all.
Mahalialee4
New Member
The Word of God is not enough? Prayer and Praise as in the time of the early believers is not enough? Pentecost was not enough? I wonder how the Apostles and Prophets made it through without the organ backing up the preacher and punctuating what he is saying, without the whooping and the hollering, and the passing of the collection plate, falling out and the face painting and the miming....God was pleased with them. So is this really for God or to keep the people entertained and "current with the latest wave for church services ?"
Would the people start leaving if they removed those things? Book of Hebrews tells how his saints pleased Him through their FAITH. He says without Faith it is impossible to please Him. All this other stuff is NOT THE WORKS THAT HE SAID WE ARE TO BE DOING, (understanding that Faith without Works is dead). He said if you love me "YOU WILL KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS." What is happening in churches may be alright with Man and our flesh, But is it pleasing HIM?
Are people going there to get entertained? The little children painting in Sunday School and the Adults painting their faces and dancing ...How...Choreographed dancing...For What?...just for the sake of having a 'dancing team? And some are doing the "Club rock and sway" with a little groove thrown in up in there and you all know it. Are we telling the Father that He doesn't make any sense without it? That without it we are ....Bored? Who In the Churches is coming up with all of these 'new traditions?'
Why is Everything planned by some person in the church from the minute you hit the door till you leave....right down to the last organ cue in so many cases.
WE NEED 'TO BE DELIVERED' FROM THE TRADITIONS OF MEN...We are 'making the Word of God invalid because of the Traditions of Men.' Christ told the religious leaders that to their faces.
Has anyone ever read the Book of Hebrews? How did the Saints at that time make it through?
THROUGH FAITH....IN THE WORD
Would the people start leaving if they removed those things? Book of Hebrews tells how his saints pleased Him through their FAITH. He says without Faith it is impossible to please Him. All this other stuff is NOT THE WORKS THAT HE SAID WE ARE TO BE DOING, (understanding that Faith without Works is dead). He said if you love me "YOU WILL KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS." What is happening in churches may be alright with Man and our flesh, But is it pleasing HIM?
Are people going there to get entertained? The little children painting in Sunday School and the Adults painting their faces and dancing ...How...Choreographed dancing...For What?...just for the sake of having a 'dancing team? And some are doing the "Club rock and sway" with a little groove thrown in up in there and you all know it. Are we telling the Father that He doesn't make any sense without it? That without it we are ....Bored? Who In the Churches is coming up with all of these 'new traditions?'
Why is Everything planned by some person in the church from the minute you hit the door till you leave....right down to the last organ cue in so many cases.
WE NEED 'TO BE DELIVERED' FROM THE TRADITIONS OF MEN...We are 'making the Word of God invalid because of the Traditions of Men.' Christ told the religious leaders that to their faces.
Has anyone ever read the Book of Hebrews? How did the Saints at that time make it through?
THROUGH FAITH....IN THE WORD
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momi
Well-Known Member
My sentiments exactly. I am having a hard time these days with the modern-day church. I have to constantly pray against unnecessary cynicism because it seems that we have gotten SSOOOO far away from the Truth. My husband and I have been reading through Acts and have been utterly blown away at the ways of the early church. There ways of fellowship and sharing the good news do not even resemble what goes on in the average church.
After I finish my griping I then ask God what He wants me to do. I think I already know... but it is going to cost.
aribell
formerly nicola.kirwan
While I respect your faith and opinion on this, I think that it is a mistake to automatically assume an entertainment mentality into these types of groups. I think that it does a great disservice to the believers offering their worship in sincere faith and praise.
There was dancing in the Bible. There is no description of how they danced, where those dances originated, how they adorned themselves, etc. What type of dance would satisfy you as being sufficiently "Christian"?
momi
Well-Known Member
I believe the motivations are truly sincere, my daughter dances on the praise team and it is beautiful worship. My thoughts are around the state of the church in general. IMO, we all (including myself) are so far away from where we are supposed to be.
Zeal
Well-Known Member
Praise Dancing and Miming is not new. Our Church has had Mimes for over 10 years or so. The paint is to show facial expression.
I am a praise dancer. Our leader is a trained dancer. What is wrong with a dance being choreographed?
At each one our rehersals it is made clear that we are not here to entertain we are here to edify. When you are moved by the spirit in dance it breaks yokes. I always ask God to take over. But my praise is real and true in my dance. I give my all when I dance. I feel the song and lyrics when I dance.
We only dance to edifying and praise songs.
I can't even explain it. I brings me joy to dnace before the Lord. I just read about david last week in Bible study dancing oout of his clothes and how his wife reacted.
You know the story....
I am a praise dancer. Our leader is a trained dancer. What is wrong with a dance being choreographed?
At each one our rehersals it is made clear that we are not here to entertain we are here to edify. When you are moved by the spirit in dance it breaks yokes. I always ask God to take over. But my praise is real and true in my dance. I give my all when I dance. I feel the song and lyrics when I dance.
We only dance to edifying and praise songs.
I can't even explain it. I brings me joy to dnace before the Lord. I just read about david last week in Bible study dancing oout of his clothes and how his wife reacted.
You know the story....
Mahalialee4
New Member
My reply to the comments: Will have to do it in segments due to space.
First on the subject of Miming...which is what the original post was about:
The Art of 'Miming' did not originate with God's people
n.
1.
a. A form of ancient Greek and Roman theatrical entertainment in which familiar characters and situations were farcically portrayed on stage, often with coarse dialogue and ludicrous actions.
b. A performance of or dialogue for such an entertainment.
c. A performer in a mime.
2. A modern performer who specializes in comic mimicry.
3.
a. The art of portraying characters and acting out situations or a narrative by gestures and body movement without the use of words; pantomime.
b. A performance of pantomime.
c. An actor or actress skilled in pantomime.
v., mimed, mim•ing, mimes.
v.tr.
1. To ridicule by imitation; mimic.
2. To act out with gestures and body movement.
v.intr.
1. To act as a mimic.
2. To portray characters and situations by gesture and body movement.
[Latin mīmus, from Greek mīmos.] http://www.answers.com/topic/mime
The History of Mime
Primitive Times
Mime is considered one of the earliest mediums of self-expression. Before there was spoken language, mime was used to communicate what the primitive people needed or wanted. Instead of fading into obscurity when the spoken language was developed, mime had became a form of entertainment. It then developed into a true theatrical form in ancient Greece, where performers enacted everyday scenes with the help of elaborate gestures. The principle mimes were known as ethologues, and the scenes they would perform would teach moral lessons.
Ancient Greeks and Romans
This is where it all began: the Theater of Dionysus in Athens. Masked actors performed outdoors, in daylight, before audiences of 10,000 or more at festivals in honor of Dionysus, the god of theater. The most elaborate form of Mime, known as hypothesis, may have approached the level of true drama. This would be performed by companies of actors, who would often concentrate more on the development of their characters, than the plot itself. Often one actor would play the part of several individuals in the production.
The comedy and tragedy which developed in Athens and flourished in the fifth and fourth centuries BC, have influenced nearly all subsequent Western drama, starting with that of the Romans. When the Romans conquered Greece, they brought Greek art of mime back to Italy and set about making it their own.
The Romans, with their love of spectacle, soon took over the existing theaters in Greece and began renovating and rebuilding them for their own spectacles, which included everything from pantomime to mock- naval battles. The remains of the Theater of Dionysus which we can see in Athens today date to Roman times and not the fifth century BC.
Mime enjoyed much success and growth under Emperor Augustus of Rome.
After the fall of the Roman empire, the Christian church showed great opposition to the bawdy, and often indecent associations of Mime, and excommunicated all performers, and closed down all the theatres. Despite this, the basic form of Mime survived. As the Church began to relax its attitude, mystery and morality plays began to appear with religious themes, many performed in mime.
My comments about miming were as a result of the origin, the history and the fact that the early believers wanted no part of it. However, the 'Christian' Church has 'relaxed' and admitted so many things, including pagan customs that we take for granted as being 'Christian.'
First on the subject of Miming...which is what the original post was about:
The Art of 'Miming' did not originate with God's people
n.
1.
a. A form of ancient Greek and Roman theatrical entertainment in which familiar characters and situations were farcically portrayed on stage, often with coarse dialogue and ludicrous actions.
b. A performance of or dialogue for such an entertainment.
c. A performer in a mime.
2. A modern performer who specializes in comic mimicry.
3.
a. The art of portraying characters and acting out situations or a narrative by gestures and body movement without the use of words; pantomime.
b. A performance of pantomime.
c. An actor or actress skilled in pantomime.
v., mimed, mim•ing, mimes.
v.tr.
1. To ridicule by imitation; mimic.
2. To act out with gestures and body movement.
v.intr.
1. To act as a mimic.
2. To portray characters and situations by gesture and body movement.
[Latin mīmus, from Greek mīmos.] http://www.answers.com/topic/mime
The History of Mime
Primitive Times
Mime is considered one of the earliest mediums of self-expression. Before there was spoken language, mime was used to communicate what the primitive people needed or wanted. Instead of fading into obscurity when the spoken language was developed, mime had became a form of entertainment. It then developed into a true theatrical form in ancient Greece, where performers enacted everyday scenes with the help of elaborate gestures. The principle mimes were known as ethologues, and the scenes they would perform would teach moral lessons.
Ancient Greeks and Romans
This is where it all began: the Theater of Dionysus in Athens. Masked actors performed outdoors, in daylight, before audiences of 10,000 or more at festivals in honor of Dionysus, the god of theater. The most elaborate form of Mime, known as hypothesis, may have approached the level of true drama. This would be performed by companies of actors, who would often concentrate more on the development of their characters, than the plot itself. Often one actor would play the part of several individuals in the production.
The comedy and tragedy which developed in Athens and flourished in the fifth and fourth centuries BC, have influenced nearly all subsequent Western drama, starting with that of the Romans. When the Romans conquered Greece, they brought Greek art of mime back to Italy and set about making it their own.
The Romans, with their love of spectacle, soon took over the existing theaters in Greece and began renovating and rebuilding them for their own spectacles, which included everything from pantomime to mock- naval battles. The remains of the Theater of Dionysus which we can see in Athens today date to Roman times and not the fifth century BC.
Mime enjoyed much success and growth under Emperor Augustus of Rome.
After the fall of the Roman empire, the Christian church showed great opposition to the bawdy, and often indecent associations of Mime, and excommunicated all performers, and closed down all the theatres. Despite this, the basic form of Mime survived. As the Church began to relax its attitude, mystery and morality plays began to appear with religious themes, many performed in mime.
My comments about miming were as a result of the origin, the history and the fact that the early believers wanted no part of it. However, the 'Christian' Church has 'relaxed' and admitted so many things, including pagan customs that we take for granted as being 'Christian.'
Mahalialee4
New Member
Yes, the Hebrews danced. But they did not do the 'club rock and sway' that is happening in many cases. Miriam led the ladies in singing and dancing before the Lord after they came through the Red Sea. David danced before the Lord.
I recognize the difference between "miming and dancing."To mime means to 'pretend". So if it is just dance worship, why call it MIME? Call it 'Dancing'.
I have visited a lot of different churches and observed what went on including churches of 'Christian Jews' that did 'Jewish'circle dancing. I have also oberved some very 'worldly exhibitions" and 'theatrical exhibitions" and much of what I have observed did not glorify God. It satisfied the flesh of the dancers and the observers. It gave a lively program for the church. It brought in the people and it kept them there.
BUT THE REAL ISSUE IS......when it is being done...IS GOD SATISFIED WITH WHAT IS BEING DONE AND HOW IT IS BEING DONE? The issue is not and never was...What satisfies Me. When 'the people of the world' come into your gatherings...Do they see 'the reflection of what goes on in polite theatre, or the clubs....just toned down?...If so, How does that glorify God.?..Is face painting and miming something that He blesses? Are we not to test the spirit to see what originates from God? or question the source of what is happening among us?
The Word of God tells me, to TEST THE SPIRIT. Not what I think, or what I feel, or what everyone else around me thinks or feels. The fact that it is being CALLED "Mime" is self explanatory. It is A 'WORLDLY' NAME AND PRACTICE, that has been brought in to the 'church' and it's origins are from the PAGAN world. That is a fact!
As a believer I am to question these things. So are all believers. If is pagan...it is pagan.
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Mahalialee4
New Member
Yes. You are right. MIME is not NEW. But is it Scriptural? Is there a Godly precedent for 'miming' by God's people in His Church or was it brought in from pagans? Does the Scriptures say that Adam and Eve were unable to talk and had 'mime' to express themselves? They were talking in the Garden of Eden. God and Adam were talking to each other, and so was Eve and God. Even the serpent was talking...So what's up with miming...to make something plain? God gave us a mouth and speech.
Dancing before the Lord in spirit and in truth is a beautiful thing. It is called 'dancing before the Lord.' It is real. But that is not called MIME. Do you have a scriptural reference for 'painting the face to dance for God" from the Word of God? I know that pagans and heathens do this...paint their faces and bodies to dance....we are not to learn the ways of the heathens, the Word of God says, but if you have clear Biblical support for this, please share it with me. Does it state that Miriam or David painted themselves and danced? I have no problem accepting Scriptural reference.
Please understand this:
I live in a multicultural society, and I see this sort of thing happening with the Chinese, The East Indians, the people from Bali, The Africans etc. etc. every year at Cultural exposes and they are dancing to a variety of different pagan gods. I go to the malls and people are getting their faces painted, including babies.....it has become a cultural phenomenom...that originally only pagans were doing...just like "tatoos"...and they do not consider this as having anything to do with "worship of any god". So what is up with the paint, for believers?
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aribell
formerly nicola.kirwan
In some Christian circles, you cover or efface oneself in order to bring the focus to God. You aren't looking at Kiesha and Tiffany and Kim, seeing how cute they are and how well they dance; rather, faces are covered because it's not about them. I think that people can easily impose their negative associations with something onto other believers' actions without actually knowing where those believers' hearts lie.
The question of motive is something that is going to be different in every church, every dance group, every individual Christian, meaning that it cannot be assumed that a dance team is acting in a self-glorifying way until you go there and talk to them and see the spirit in that particular place and among those particular believers.
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Mahalialee4
New Member
deleted: double post
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Mahalialee4
New Member
My point is: We can all justify what we do as worship. But it is GOD WHO SETS THE STANDARDS OF WHAT IS ACCEPTABLE WORSHIP TO HIM, not us. He is the one RECEIVING THIS WORSHIP, right? Does GOD HAVE ANY SAY IN THIS AT ALL? OR IS IT THE PEOLE WHO DECIDE?
If the ORIGIN of something is PAGAN...HEATHEN.......then it has NEGATIVE ASSOCIATIONS FOR BELIEVERS....'UNTRUTHful origins'.
It is not my place to judge believers HEARTS...THAT IS GOD'S REALM.
But it is the believers place to question and to test the spirit of activities that are being performed "IN THE NAME OF WORSHIPPING GOD". If the origin was PAGAN , was done by PAGANS and continues to be done by PAGANS, as a form of 'worship', we need to be very careful in 'upholding or promoting certain activities...NOT DECIDING FOR GOD THAT IT IS "Christian" and He needs OR HAS TO accept it. Who do we think we are?
Painting the face and Miming and calling it a 'good thing', I cannot do that. It is Pagan in origin and practice. That is not called "being holier than thou....That is called 'Godly fear'. We are told to "keep testing whether or not we are in the faith". Remember, the Israelites were adapting pagan customs and worship into their 'serving Him'. Look what God did to them, for bringing in these pagan activities! The Word says that 'What happened to them was written as A WARNING EXAMPLE TO US!" The World just shakes its head because we 'throw' a Christian tag on what THEY ALREADY KNOW IS A PAGAN CUSTOM.
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Yes, the Hebrews danced. But they did not do the 'club rock and sway' that is happening in many cases.
Quite possibly. We have no real way of verifying how they danced. But what we do know as fact is that David danced his clothes off before the Lord in praise and thanksgiving.David's answer was simple: I'll humiliate myself even more for my Lord. End result, Michal had no child until the day of her death.
Miriam led the ladies in singing and dancing before the Lord after they came through the Red Sea. David danced before the Lord.
I recognize the difference between "miming and dancing."To mime means to 'pretend". So if it is just dance worship, why call it MIME? Call it 'Dancing'.
I have visited a lot of different churches and observed what went on including churches of 'Christian Jews' that did 'Jewish'circle dancing. I have also oberved some very 'worldly exhibitions" and 'theatrical exhibitions" and much of what I have observed did not glorify God. It satisfied the flesh of the dancers and the observers. It gave a lively program for the church. It brought in the people and it kept them there.
BUT THE REAL ISSUE IS......when it is being done...IS GOD SATISFIED WITH WHAT IS BEING DONE AND HOW IT IS BEING DONE?
I believe the only issue is: Is God being satisfied? How it is being done is null and void if the former is fulfilled.
The issue is not and never was...What satisfies Me. When 'the people of the world' come into your gatherings...Do they see 'the reflection of what goes on in polite theatre, or the clubs....just toned down?...If so, How does that glorify God.?..Is face painting and miming something that He blesses? Are we not to test the spirit to see what originates from God? or question the source of what is happening among us?
The Word of God tells me, to TEST THE SPIRIT.
Right. Because many false prophets are among us. Every spirit that acknowledges that Christ came in the flesh is from God. I'm not sure what this has to do with mimes or dancers. But if we use this test in reference to them, I think most would confess Christ.
Not what I think, or what I feel, or what everyone else around me thinks or feels. The fact that it is being CALLED "Mime" is self explanatory. It is A 'WORLDLY' NAME AND PRACTICE, that has been brought in to the 'church' and it's origins are from the PAGAN world. That is a fact!
As a believer I am to question these things. So are all believers. If is pagan...it is pagan.
The same has been said of Christmas and Easter. To my knowledge, neither has kept anyone from seeking, finding and having a full relationship with Christ.
A huge disservice. We have to be very careful that we're not carrying a spirit of bondage and causing others to be bound based on perception and judgement. If the Son sets you free, you shall be free indeed.
Mahalialee4
New Member
As stated: "As long as God is pleased...is the bottom line for ME".
I trust that you understand that He may convict some people on things that you do not feel convicted about. Be prepared that not everyone will feel free to do these things...not because of 'BONDAGE' but because of KNOWING where it originated from. When He puts his finger on certain things for you...that finger may not have been put on another person at that time....I have had to walk away from some things that in the past, I saw nothing wrong with. But that is me. And you know what, some things that you are doing today, a few years from now, you may say: "I can no longer do those things, I feel convicted". I am sure that has been the case in a variety of things and situations in your walk. (And it may not have been what ANYONE ELSE would have considered "bad or wrong", or that you could have put YOUR finger on it, BUT GOD PUT HIS FINGER ON IT.) You probably have had friends ask you: "Why don't you....anymore?....you have really changed...." so try not to over react to my posts. You may have to state a new stand because of conscience toward God on some things yourself someday. Hopefully your friends and sisters will respect that whether they understand where you are coming from or not.
"Me thinks thou dost protest too much!"
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Overreacting? No. Disagreeing? Yes. However, I do agree that the Holy Spirit may convict you of things which he may not convict another. But of course, He must do the convicting. Quenching the praise and worship of someone else based on personal convictions and/or perception does indeed stem from a spirit of bondage. But then that would be just another area in which we disagree.
Mahalialee4
New Member
This is very important to you. With all sincerity and respect: Let me understand what you are saying.
Someone saying they do not agree with ‘miming in Church’…QUENCHES YOUR SPIRIT?
Now the fact that you agree with it and maybe do it …DOES NOT QUENCH MY SPIRIT OR MY PRAISE.
The fact that I know the Origin of a practice….and stated it….QUENCHES YOUR SPIRIT AND YOUR PRAISE.
Since I live in another country there is no possibility of me sharing a pew with you. Obviously I would never interrupt what you are doing…and even if I were, why would I?
So are you saying that 'anyone' who does NOT AGREE with 'miming' and 'fleshly dancing' (note that I did not say any dancing at all!) in Church who DOES NOT even ATTEND YOUR CHURCH...'IS guilty of QUENCHING YOUR PRAISE?". I am sure that in your lifetime you will come across MANY people who do not agree, will VOICE their opinion and THEIR AWARENESS ...choose NOT to attend your church..or any church for that matter......and certainly not come in and 'interrupt your services'...who would do that?.......Would that really’ QUENCH YOUR SPIRIT AND PRAISE’?
There are 'many churches and pastors that do NOT agree with it and would tell their congregations so… from their pulpit.' ….are they all under 'bondage as well' or Is miming and specific forms of dancing the ‘liitmus test’ for being ‘bondage free?’
Now if you believe that the Holy Spirit does the ‘convicting’....how can His Spirit possibly be.. a spirit of bondage? He does not give us.. a spirit of bondage! I know my Scriptural reasons for not doing so it so I do not feel bound or consider myself ‘bound ‘ because I do not ‘mime’. I am free to dance before the Lord. I do not even have to go to church to do that.
Now if your same pastor were to get 'convicted one day' regarding 'miming'...based on what was revealed to him in 'his spirit' about it because of ‘its roots’ ...and said he was 'removing miming’ from the Church calendar of activities and from the 'praise and worship’…saying “Dance all you want as long as it glorifies God…but the painted face miming has got to go!...I have to be obedient to God....how would you handle it? What would your options be, because obviously this is very important to you? Would you say: “If I cannot paint my face and mime any more, my family is out of here? My children won’t come to church if you do this!....Would it be “mime or move?”
The conviction I received was not ‘my’ personal conviction or PERSONAL perception:
This is the Scripture you were referring to when you were talking about ”Quench not the Spirit”.
1 Thessalonians 5:16 REJOICE EVERMORE. 17Pray without ceasing. 18In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.
19 QUENCH NOT THE SPIRIT. 20Despise not PROPHESYINGS. 21 PROVE ALL THINGS things; HOLD FAST THAT WHICH IS GOOD 22 ABSTAIN FROM ALL APPEARANCE OF EVIL.
…DID YOU NOTICE THE PART OF THE SCRIPTURE that says: ….PROVE ‘ALL’ THINGS…HOLD FAST THAT WHICH IS ‘GOOD’…..’ABSTAIN’ FROM 'ALL' ‘APPEARANCE’ OF ‘EVIL’?
So when God put HIS finger on something I was seeing RE: some practices …HE brought to mind His Scriptures, I checked the ORIGIN of ’miming’. Now since the source or root of it WAS HEATHEN OR PAGAN (the painting of the face and miming)…it did not seem to be something that I should want to hold fast to as being GOOD…so I was convicted to ‘Abstain’ (keep away from it…not get involved with it), to avoid the very ‘appearance of evil’,…out of obedience to the Holy Spirit….are you saying that the Holy Scriptures and the Holy Spirit, also having me ‘PROVE’ (for myself)whether it was from a good or bad origin….by holding fast to the Spirit and the Word ….this put me under a ‘spirit of bondage’ and now I have a ‘spirit of bondage’.
No, I could not accept that about the Scriptures or the Holy Spirit. One of the works of the Spirit is to guide us and to warn us: I obeyed the warning: These were the Scriptures impressed on my spirit. precepts.
Deuteronomy 12:30 " BEWARE that you are NOT ENSNARED to FOLLOW THEM, after they are destroyed before you, and that you do NOT inquire after THEIR gods, saying, 'HOW do THESE nations SERVE THEIR GODS, that I ALSO MAY DO LIKEWISE?'
Jeremiah 10:2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of THE HEATHEN, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them
Matthew 11:16But whereunto shall I liken this generation? It is like unto children sitting in the markets, and calling unto their fellows, 17And saying, We have piped unto you, and YE HAVE NOT DANCED; we have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented. 18For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, HE HATH A DEVIL. 19The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children. "
So my being convicted by the Holy Spirit, after becoming aware of the Origin of Miming and PERSUADED not to dance in any way when I am worshipping that He would condemn...and this being confirmed to me by the Word of God....resulting in my TAKING A PERSONAL STAND...you are saying "I have 'a spirit' of bondage?"...which is a 'devil?' Now did I say anything like that to you or anyone, that you had a demon or devil or a wicked or evil spirit? ...I will leave the contemplation of that particular statement about me between you and the Lord.
Someone saying they do not agree with ‘miming in Church’…QUENCHES YOUR SPIRIT?
Now the fact that you agree with it and maybe do it …DOES NOT QUENCH MY SPIRIT OR MY PRAISE.
The fact that I know the Origin of a practice….and stated it….QUENCHES YOUR SPIRIT AND YOUR PRAISE.
Since I live in another country there is no possibility of me sharing a pew with you. Obviously I would never interrupt what you are doing…and even if I were, why would I?
So are you saying that 'anyone' who does NOT AGREE with 'miming' and 'fleshly dancing' (note that I did not say any dancing at all!) in Church who DOES NOT even ATTEND YOUR CHURCH...'IS guilty of QUENCHING YOUR PRAISE?". I am sure that in your lifetime you will come across MANY people who do not agree, will VOICE their opinion and THEIR AWARENESS ...choose NOT to attend your church..or any church for that matter......and certainly not come in and 'interrupt your services'...who would do that?.......Would that really’ QUENCH YOUR SPIRIT AND PRAISE’?
There are 'many churches and pastors that do NOT agree with it and would tell their congregations so… from their pulpit.' ….are they all under 'bondage as well' or Is miming and specific forms of dancing the ‘liitmus test’ for being ‘bondage free?’
Now if you believe that the Holy Spirit does the ‘convicting’....how can His Spirit possibly be.. a spirit of bondage? He does not give us.. a spirit of bondage! I know my Scriptural reasons for not doing so it so I do not feel bound or consider myself ‘bound ‘ because I do not ‘mime’. I am free to dance before the Lord. I do not even have to go to church to do that.
Now if your same pastor were to get 'convicted one day' regarding 'miming'...based on what was revealed to him in 'his spirit' about it because of ‘its roots’ ...and said he was 'removing miming’ from the Church calendar of activities and from the 'praise and worship’…saying “Dance all you want as long as it glorifies God…but the painted face miming has got to go!...I have to be obedient to God....how would you handle it? What would your options be, because obviously this is very important to you? Would you say: “If I cannot paint my face and mime any more, my family is out of here? My children won’t come to church if you do this!....Would it be “mime or move?”
The conviction I received was not ‘my’ personal conviction or PERSONAL perception:
This is the Scripture you were referring to when you were talking about ”Quench not the Spirit”.
1 Thessalonians 5:16 REJOICE EVERMORE. 17Pray without ceasing. 18In every thing give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you.
19 QUENCH NOT THE SPIRIT. 20Despise not PROPHESYINGS. 21 PROVE ALL THINGS things; HOLD FAST THAT WHICH IS GOOD 22 ABSTAIN FROM ALL APPEARANCE OF EVIL.
…DID YOU NOTICE THE PART OF THE SCRIPTURE that says: ….PROVE ‘ALL’ THINGS…HOLD FAST THAT WHICH IS ‘GOOD’…..’ABSTAIN’ FROM 'ALL' ‘APPEARANCE’ OF ‘EVIL’?
So when God put HIS finger on something I was seeing RE: some practices …HE brought to mind His Scriptures, I checked the ORIGIN of ’miming’. Now since the source or root of it WAS HEATHEN OR PAGAN (the painting of the face and miming)…it did not seem to be something that I should want to hold fast to as being GOOD…so I was convicted to ‘Abstain’ (keep away from it…not get involved with it), to avoid the very ‘appearance of evil’,…out of obedience to the Holy Spirit….are you saying that the Holy Scriptures and the Holy Spirit, also having me ‘PROVE’ (for myself)whether it was from a good or bad origin….by holding fast to the Spirit and the Word ….this put me under a ‘spirit of bondage’ and now I have a ‘spirit of bondage’.
No, I could not accept that about the Scriptures or the Holy Spirit. One of the works of the Spirit is to guide us and to warn us: I obeyed the warning: These were the Scriptures impressed on my spirit. precepts.
Deuteronomy 12:30 " BEWARE that you are NOT ENSNARED to FOLLOW THEM, after they are destroyed before you, and that you do NOT inquire after THEIR gods, saying, 'HOW do THESE nations SERVE THEIR GODS, that I ALSO MAY DO LIKEWISE?'
Jeremiah 10:2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of THE HEATHEN, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them
Matthew 11:16But whereunto shall I liken this generation? It is like unto children sitting in the markets, and calling unto their fellows, 17And saying, We have piped unto you, and YE HAVE NOT DANCED; we have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented. 18For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, HE HATH A DEVIL. 19The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children. "
So my being convicted by the Holy Spirit, after becoming aware of the Origin of Miming and PERSUADED not to dance in any way when I am worshipping that He would condemn...and this being confirmed to me by the Word of God....resulting in my TAKING A PERSONAL STAND...you are saying "I have 'a spirit' of bondage?"...which is a 'devil?' Now did I say anything like that to you or anyone, that you had a demon or devil or a wicked or evil spirit? ...I will leave the contemplation of that particular statement about me between you and the Lord.
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momi
Well-Known Member
These are some excellent scripture references and I must give a hearty Amen to your post in general. Many of us don't want to give up our sacred cows... but it is very difficult to disagree with scripture. If a thing has been tried and found to have a roots of evil we are to flee... there is no way around it.
levette
Well-Known Member
No offense, but it is being done alot in my church and it doesn't feel spiritural or right. I do not feel the presence of God when it is being done. I do not see why the faces have to be painted either. I feel that too much has slid into my church in the name of religion. For example, in my churce a member mimed to a Whitney Houston song- I believe. I was afraid lightning was going to strike in the sanctuary.
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