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  #1  
Old 03-27-2007, 10:42 AM
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Shimmie Shimmie is offline
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Default "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

A few weeks ago I attended an evening service where our Pastor was the guest speaker. The Pastor of the church was female and in the Program her husband was listed as 'First Man."

For some reason, this just messes with me. *long sigh* I dunno.

It was worded like this.... "Pastor (her name) ............... and First Man (his name) ..............."

Another Church that I was viewing on TV announced the leadership like this:

"Pastor (her name)................. and her husband Associate Pastor (his name) ......................."

Somehow, this wording is not giving the man his proper place in leadership. Call me old fashioned, but the man should always be titled as the leader and not his wife. There has to be a better way to present this. I know that we have many women in leadership but she should never be titled above her husband. This is not scriptual. The husband is the head of the wife. Period.

So, how would you title this if this were your Church ministry?

Thanks in advance for your thoughts....
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Last edited by Shimmie; 03-27-2007 at 10:58 AM.
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Old 03-27-2007, 11:43 AM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shimmie
A few weeks ago I attended an evening service where our Pastor was the guest speaker. The Pastor of the church was female and in the Program her husband was listed as 'First Man."

For some reason, this just messes with me. *long sigh* I dunno.

It was worded like this.... "Pastor (her name) ............... and First Man (his name) ..............."

Another Church that I was viewing on TV announced the leadership like this:

"Pastor (her name)................. and her husband Associate Pastor (his name) ......................."

Somehow, this wording is not giving the man his proper place in leadership. Call me old fashioned, but the man should always be titled as the leader and not his wife. There has to be a better way to present this. I know that we have many women in leadership but she should never be titled above her husband. This is not scriptual. The husband is the head of the wife. Period.

So, how would you title this if this were your Church ministry?

Thanks in advance for your thoughts....
I agree. I think they should word it as "Pastors ........!" Even though her role may be more 'pastoral', in the sense that she may be doing more preaching and counseling, her husband is still her covering and she and her husband are in ministry, together.
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Old 03-27-2007, 11:54 AM
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Wink Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nice & Wavy
I agree. I think they should word it as "Pastors ........!" Even though her role may be more 'pastoral', in the sense that she may be doing more preaching and counseling, her husband is still her covering and she and her husband are in ministry, together.
I'm so glad you replied. Gee whiz, I just feel so 'uneasy' about this.

I don't ever want to see a man 'under' a woman. I just don't. It's not right. He leads at all times. It's like saying 'she's the boss and he's the toss...tossed to one side while she gets the recognitions.

I like 'Pastors'........afterall, doesn't he at least pray or give a benediction or have some active responsibility in the Church?

Thanks for hearing my vent... As always you understand me... Well you do. And that ain't easy, not at all.

Love and blessings to you and stay Nice and Wavy...
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Old 03-27-2007, 12:26 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Wow, that's crazy! My mentor is a Christian business speaker and even she submits to her husband as the head as he is the head, the CEO and leader in the company and she is simply the "mouth pice" but he is the brains and leadership beihnd the whole program. To me that shows respect and reverence for her husband. The thing you posted looks belittling to the husband to me.
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Old 03-27-2007, 12:36 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbragg
Wow, that's crazy! My mentor is a Christian business speaker and even she submits to her husband as the head as he is the head, the CEO and leader in the company and she is simply the "mouth pice" but he is the brains and leadership beihnd the whole program. To me that shows respect and reverence for her husband. The thing you posted looks belittling to the husband to me.
Thanks Lady K... That's exactly how I felt as soon as I saw the front page of the program. My heart just 'sank' so to speak. She should not be looked up to 'above' her husband. It's just not right.

Thanks again for your comments.
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Old 03-27-2007, 12:55 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Is the husband a Pastor?
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Old 03-27-2007, 01:49 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

I've never heard of "First Man" before. I don't like it. I don't go by "First Lady" though I'm married to a pastor so maybe I'm the wrong person to ask.
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Old 03-27-2007, 02:04 PM
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Wink Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexstin
I've never heard of "First Man" before. I don't like it. I don't go by "First Lady" though I'm married to a pastor so maybe I'm the wrong person to ask.
Thanks for responding Pastor Alexstin.

I'm glad that this is up for discussion, for it does present a 'problem' in my view as honoring our husbands. I can fully understand a woman being called 'First Lady.' Afterall, she is the Lady of the House; his life and his heart, body and soul. No one else is called to this postion, but her.

It is 'she' who upholds her husband in the ministry no matter what. It is she whom he can come to at anytime day or night and lay his heart upon hers without judgement nor rejection. She's the one who intecedes for his every need and bows down to worship God on his behalf during those times when he cannot go any further...for he IS the head and being the head of anything is not an easy task. The responsibilities are beyond that of any member of any congregation.

My point is the wife has HER place and the Husband has HIS place. And "First Ladies' have a call that no one could ever match or succeed.

Pastor... you are definitely your husband's "ONLY Lady" in every sense of the word... you truly are. It's NOT an easy call to be a Pastor's wife, but you are indeed called and you have been annointed for all that it calls upon you to do.

Post Edited: From 'First Lady to ONLY Lady....
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Last edited by Shimmie; 03-27-2007 at 09:18 PM.
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  #9  
Old 03-27-2007, 02:09 PM
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Wink Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by senimoni
Is the husband a Pastor?
Hi Senimoni:

This is a very good question. From all indications, it appears that the 'women' in both cases have the title of Pastor and he does not. But even so, there has to be a following of the order, acknowledging the man as the head of the woman.

The way that it has been presented, makes the husband appear as 'under' her leadership which is not good nor correct, in ministry or in the world's system. Men are leaders; that's God's order and should be the heart of the woman who stands beside him, not in front of him...

I hope I'm making sense. Thanks Senimoni.
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Old 03-27-2007, 02:46 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Eh.... pretty much what everybody else said.... Hmmmm.... with regard to acknowledgment about the titles/functions, the title "First Man" does not work for the same reason that "First Lady" doesn't work for me: it implies that there are other ladies (my pastor's wife made it very clear when they first started pastoring that we do not refer to her as "first lady" for that very reason. She started off as "Sister", then she was "Minister" , then she went to "Co-Pastor", and then "Pastor" and now "Dr.".

It would be helpful to know if the man/husband functions in the role of a pastor... so if he does not, then maybe his name should not be included on the documentation at all and then as the pastor gets up and sets the order, she makes it VERY CLEAR who her husband is and acknowledges his covering.

And Dear Shimmie, I'll just say it for ya: the way that that program presented their names like that, it looks "HEN-PECKED" and from where I come from, that's um... well... yeah... ok.... The men take and have the lead. My pastor's wife says it like this (more for the home than the pulpit): he's the head, but I'm in charge.
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Old 03-27-2007, 02:54 PM
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Wink Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RelaxerRehab
Eh.... pretty much what everybody else said.... Hmmmm.... with regard to acknowledgment about the titles/functions, the title "First Man" does not work for the same reason that "First Lady" doesn't work for me: it implies that there are other ladies (my pastor's wife made it very clear when they first started pastoring that we do not refer to her as "first lady" for that very reason. She started off as "Sister", then she was "Minister" , then she went to "Co-Pastor", and then "Pastor" and now "Dr.".

It would be helpful to know if the man/husband functions in the role of a pastor... so if he does not, then maybe his name should not be included on the documentation at all and then as the pastor gets up and sets the order, she makes it VERY CLEAR who her husband is and acknowledges his covering.

And Dear Shimmie, I'll just say it for ya: the way that that program presented their names like that, it looks "HEN-PECKED" and from where I come from, that's um... well... yeah... ok.... The men take and have the lead. My pastor's wife says it like this (more for the home than the pulpit): he's the head, but I'm in charge.
Thanks Rehab....

I'm taking notice regarding the title "First Lady". I need to change my stance on using that term. My thought was as it's used in the White House. The other mentions you made make more sense (Pastor and Dr. - as she's earned her doctorate).

Hey, if Hilary Clinton wins the election as President, does this make Bill "First Man".... Sorry, couldn't resist.
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Old 03-27-2007, 03:12 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shimmie
Thanks Rehab....

I'm taking notice regarding the title "First Lady". I need to change my stance on using that term. My thought was as it's used in the White House. The other mentions you made make more sense (Pastor and Dr. - as she's earned her doctorate).

Hey, if Hilary Clinton wins the election as President, does this make Bill "First Man".... Sorry, couldn't resist.
You make an interesting point about the potential origin of the term "first lady", etc. Goodness, our churches are one big (sometimes bad) mix of secular influences....

I say just put who the man is: Husband to the Pastor, or Husband of the President, etc. (Shrug)
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Old 03-27-2007, 03:29 PM
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Wink Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RelaxerRehab
You make an interesting point about the potential origin of the term "first lady", etc. Goodness, our churches are one big (sometimes bad) mix of secular influences....

I say just put who the man is: Husband to the Pastor, or Husband of the President, etc. (Shrug)
Or in my case, "....She got a man....Yeah!!! "
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Old 03-27-2007, 04:05 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shimmie
Hey, if Hilary Clinton wins the election as President, does this make Bill "First Man".... Sorry, couldn't resist.
I was actually wondering how he would be referred to also.
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Old 03-27-2007, 04:13 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

I do agree...the term "First lady" is not a great term, even though its not bad in itself.

My husband and I are pastors. We were both ordained at the same time. Our gifts are different and we both do some things seperate, however he still is my covering and just because I'm a pastor, doesn't say that I have some type of charge over him....the order has to be clear!

If the husband is not the pastor, but the wife is, I think it would be fair not to include him in the program at all, unless he is a speaking, and then I would include him in the program, but just his name, not a title.

Maybe they just wanted to include him in some small way and someone came up with that bright idea to give him that title. He probably didn't like that title just as much as we don't like it!

People are taking titles to literally though....Yes, we are to respect the person in their respective titles that God has placed them in, but when we start making up titles and such, there has to be a line drawn, somewhere.

When I hear titles that are like: The very, very reverend, pastor, apostle, bishop of the most holy faith...those things just send crawlies up my spine, but it happens all the time.

Well, gotta go for now....love you ladies!
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Old 03-27-2007, 04:14 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexstin
I've never heard of "First Man" before. I don't like it. I don't go by "First Lady" though I'm married to a pastor so maybe I'm the wrong person to ask.
Our pastor's wife cringes at that title too. She prefers "Sis."

---

I've never heard of "First Man" either. Most of the women pastors I've heard of had a pastor or bishop as their husband.

"First Man" Smith would be like "Adam" Smith in my way of thinking.
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Old 03-27-2007, 04:18 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

I see what you are saying...but I think that she may put herself beneath her husband ...to me that doesn't equate to outsiders doing the same. I don't like the term "first man" just b/c it sounds odd but I don't agree with "bestowing" a title to a man that he hasn't earned...over his wife b/c she is submissive to him. I hope you follow what I'm saying re: how she views him as opposed to how outsiders/others should view/rank him.
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Old 03-27-2007, 04:44 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

I see your point Senimoni, but you gotta admit, "First Man" just sounds sissy-fied! Give the man his signity my goodness!
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Old 03-27-2007, 05:00 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Just a quick question, if Hillary Clinton is elected president (heaven forbid) wouldnt that make Bill first man? Would this be demeaning to him in the same way you all feel its demeaning for the pastors husband to be referred to as such. If you feel its demeaning for Bill to be referred to as such okay, if you feel its okay to refer to Bill as first man, WHY is it okay for him and not for the pastors husband. What makes the pastors husband special?
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Old 03-27-2007, 05:21 PM
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Default Re: "First Man" - Is this a Proper Title for a Man Whose Wife is a Pastor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ladydee36330
Just a quick question, if Hillary Clinton is elected president (heaven forbid) wouldnt that make Bill first man? Would this be demeaning to him in the same way you all feel its demeaning for the pastors husband to be referred to as such. If you feel its demeaning for Bill to be referred to as such okay, if you feel its okay to refer to Bill as first man, WHY is it okay for him and not for the pastors husband. What makes the pastors husband special?
I just think it sounds gay - inside or outside of the church. But then again, I've never liked the "first lady" terminology in any arena - especially in church. Guess I'm the wrong person to ask...
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